Oliver Drewes is a Reiki master practitioner based in Germany. He came across the practice in 2010, completed the first and second level of Western-style Reiki training in 2011. In 2015-2016, Oliver learned the first three levels of training of the Gendai Reiki Hō school. In autumn 2016, he completed the master and teacher training directly with the founder of the Gendai-Reiki method, Hiroshi Doi Sensei, in Japan, after repeating the previous levels of training.
Oliver is also the founder of Holistika, a book imprint that has published the work of Doi Sensei (for German-speaking countries), Frank Glatzer, and Frans Stiene's translation of The Inner Heart of Reiki (he was also the actual translator).
In addition to teaching the Reiki system, Oliver has given lectures at the ProReiki Regional Group Cologne, the professional association ProReiki, and the Reiki Convention.
DIVE INTO REIKI: Hi, Oliver. Thank you so much for accepting my invitation. I like to start every interview with the same question: how did you come in contact with Reiki practice?
OLIVER DREWES: My Reiki way began when I was very young. Sev brought me to Reiki [the first one was the] funeral of my great grandfather. At this time, I had a very special experience. I thought that I had seen him. So we all had been at the cemetery. It was on [a] hill. The sun was very strong, and suddenly I had the impression that I had seen him and that he had seen me. And at that moment, I lost consciousness, and my father saved me from falling. And all the years after, I had the impression that I had seen him. I never said I had seen him. I didn't want to be a liar. I was never sure whether I really saw him or not. This occupied my mind for more than 25 years.
In 2006, my parents gave me a phone call that there was a lady on the television. She brought people back to former lives as well as to experiences in their childhood. And they told me this could be a chance to review what I experienced. So I came in contact with this lady, and finally, she invited me to train. To my surprise, I got it as a gift from her… it was the training to become a practitioner in regression therapy. It was a nice experience. I could bring people back to their former lives, but I had not been able to do this myself. I was not able to give up control. I needed to be more relaxed.
I decided to go to a healing practitioner school in Germany to learn more about relaxation methods. There was an advertisement for Reiki. I was very interested—healing with hands sounded interesting. I went to the south of Germany because there was one seminar just one or two weeks later. When I'm interested in something, I'm not looking when it's [happening] nearby. I just want to do it right now. So, I went to the South of Germany [for] my first Reiki seminar. I'm still in contact with and friends with that teacher, but it was not the purest Reiki I could experience. It was a mixture of Reiki and healing with gemstones. I was more interested in the pure Reiki. I changed teachers, and then I found myself in a seminar, which was a mixture of Reiki and healing with angels. It was not the pure Reiki I was looking for either. I decided to continue my Reiki way when the right time came, and I would have found the right teacher.
In 2013, I went to London to the Arthur Findlay College because I wanted to know more about mediumship and the vision I had of my great grandfather. We learned a special scanning method. I could see people's problems and pains. It was very extraordinary. I went to the tutor and said, "Oh, I have seen…." He said, "No, stop, Oliver. Just get used to it. You have not seen; you have been shown. That's a big difference, but anyway, it's a gift, and you should think about what to do with it." And then I said, "Well, if this is a gift, maybe it's the right time to continue my way with and dedicate myself to healing again."
[Back] in Germany, I've been looking for a new teacher in stool and found one in Cologne, not far from where I live. Then everything started flowing. After that, I got the chance to go to Japan to learn from Hiroshi Doi [founder of Gendai Reiki.] I had the chance to translate his books. And later, I had the chance to be a speaker at different events and even got to know Frans Stiene personally. With him, I had the chance to organize trips to Japan.
My mother later told me that she had an experience that her grandfather—that was my great-grandfather—saved our family from an accident. She saw him making signs not to do certain things. And Her telling me that made it easier for me to accept my experience than any regression therapy or other [modalities.] I didn't need anymore. It was clear to me that these things could happen. But, anyway, it brought me to Reiki and where I am today.
Oliver Drewes next to Mikao Usui’s memorial stone.
DIR: You studied with eight Reiki teachers. Do you advise people to study with different masters, and what did you gain from doing so?
OD: As I mentioned first, I was looking for pure Reiki. It was fantastic to combine healing with stones. I think if someone is doing this during a treatment, it's great. But if you tell students about this, it's like giving the association that Reiki power wouldn't be strong enough and requires healing stones. The same with angels. That was not my way. So there, I already needed to go to a different teacher. Learning Gendai Reiki [gave me] more of the Japanese perspective. The style that I'm teaching and that I learned from Hiroshi Doi is nice. It's a combination of the Western and the traditional Reiki. [It includes] working with chakras, a great tool, but it's not the [authentic] Japanese way. Chakras come from India.
I wanted to go even [deeper] into the roots [of the Reiki system]. I found Frans Stiene. I really appreciate his style and his teachings. He is learning from priests in Japan to see [the practice] from a different [perspective]. You don't need to be a Buddhist or know very much about esoteric Buddhism; you can have any religion [to practice Reiki]—that's clear. But [understanding Buddhism] gives a greater understanding. As we didn't [grow up with] Japanese culture, some things have to be explained to understand what was meant by [the teachings.]
This is how I came to the first four teachers. Then I said, "Okay, let's have a look at other styles." I wanted to have a look at Jikiden Reiki. So I taught a friend of mine Gendai Reiki Ho, and I studied Jikiden from him. There are many similarities, but some things are quite different. And then, I had the chance to see the Reiki style of Chris Marsh [a renowned UK Reiki master who passed away at the beginning of 2021]. I took every opportunity to [study] different teachers and different styles. I think this is okay. Some teachers are very strict and say, "If you learn from me, it's only me and my style." And maybe even, "My style is better, and don't look at others." But I mean, if you're going to school, you have a teacher for English, you have a teacher for mathematics, and a teacher for biology. You get knowledge from different teachers. Why not in Reiki? I mean, Reiki has the same origin. Every teacher has their own way.
Hiroshi Doi, for example, compares Reiki with climbing Mount Fuji. You can go until the middle, and you decide just to be in the healthy soul. But you can continue and take the spiritual path. And when you do that, you may reach the top, Natsumi Ritsumei—a state of inner happiness and inner calmness. Every guide has his group to bring them to the top of Mount Fuji. And everyone has their way. Maybe one way is straighter; maybe the other has more views; maybe one is more exhausting, one is more relaxed, but all guides have different routes to go to the top of the mountain. It is the same with Reiki teachers. All are guides to bring their students to the top, bring them to a point to reach Natsumi Ritsumei [following] the way [that worked for them.]. There is no wrong way—they're all alternative ways [that come from] the same origin.
DIR: I love this POV beyond the metaphor. Sometimes in the Reiki community, we remain separate because we practice different styles instead of coming together to learn from each other. We should encourage the exchange between practitioners.
OD: Yeah. I had a couple of times every month a meeting with that friend. Both of our students would come, and we had a Reiki exchange. Someone said to me, "I'm not very happy with the Jikiden [style]. I don't want to deal with that." And I said, "Sorry, this is my friend. We do this in cooperation. We want to make something clear: it's not one style against the other. We are doing this together. We are one Reiki family."
You can see Mikao Usui as the founder and then compare it with a big tree. He is the root. And then the tree has many branches, many leaves. It's not one against the other or one better than the other. And if there is a possibility for cooperation, I think this will offer students and participants a better understanding. It allows us to see some things from a different point of view.
DIR: You also mentioned traveling to Japan. When I traveled to Japan, I understood Reiki to a whole new level. You organize trips to Japan to follow Mikao Usui's path. Can you tell us how you came up with that idea?
OD: [After] my first Reiki seminar, the teacher offered to choose between different raw quartz stones. That was a tradition in his style. I chose one, and it happened to be formed like a pyramid with three sides. But on one side, there was a little [defect]. And I said, "Why did I take this one?" I'm a perfectionist. And it could be so perfect if this [minor defect] wouldn't have been there. And then there was like a big voice saying, "Oliver, this stone is for you always to remember to take things as they are, and not as you want them to [be.]." I was surprised, [I kept] looking around [trying to find] who was speaking. It was an experience. At that time, I had dreams. One of those dreams was that I saw myself in Japan, organizing trips for people from all over the world. But the interesting thing was that they learned Reiki and had a seminar with a Western teacher.
When I woke up, I said, "Well, that's strange. If ever in the future, I would bring people to Japan to learn Reiki there, the country of origin, of course, I would look for a Japanese teacher. Why should I have a Westerner teaching Western people in Japan? That does not make sense! So, 15 years later, more or less, when I was there with Frans [Stiene, the co-founder of the International House of Reiki], I said, "Oh, stop! That's exactly what I was dreaming. It came true." I was not thinking of this [dream] all the time. It was not a [goal] for me, but when I found myself [in Japan] with the group, I said, "Oh, okay! I remember that dream. That's interesting."
[The idea for the trip] came [about] first after having been in the class of Hiroshi Doi in 2016. I wanted to organize trips to Japan, including a seminar with Doi. I wanted to translate from English into German for my group. But it happened that the schedule from November was changed to September because there was an unveiling ceremony of a special Memorial stone that Hiroshi Doi had put in the birth town of Mikao Usui, and all the plans changed. I couldn't go in November. The American group was going in September. Later, Hiroshi Doi said, "Oh, I don't know if I would do this the next year. I was born in 1935. I'm quite advanced in age. I'm not sure." I looked for alternatives. I [talked to] Frans, and we said, "Let's do this together."
I had everything organized. I already had organized trips to India, Sri Lanka, and Bali for people interested in spirituality. I already had some experience. Many of [Frans'] students joined us in 2019. We had a wonderful group with people from New Zealand, Australia, the UK, Italy, and [many] from the US. It was an experience to be in the country of origin for them, to practice Reiki there. I think it's a really different energy, especially when you find yourself on Mount Karama or even Mount Hiei, which is the place of origin of Buddhism in Japan. You can feel it there on the mountain with every step you make, every breath you take. There is so much of that original energy. It makes a difference.
The other aspect was that it was so nice that people from all over the world [formed] one group. We're part of the community, not only in our local town, in our country or continent, but everywhere. Friendships [were] started between the seminar takers and [with the] Japanese Reiki master that I presented in the meeting with Hiroshi Doi. It was so great for me as an organizer to see that.
I think doing this as a kind of pilgrimage—to see where Mikao Usui went to school, where he lived, the history of this town, and how everything developed gives you a better understanding [of the Reiki system.] You [get] the picture. Later, [when you teach a] class, you can show the students, "Look, this is where [Miako Usui] went to school. This is where his grandfather and uncle had the sake manufacturing." You can teach from your own experience. I think this makes a difference. Normally as a teacher, depending on where you learn, you teach what you have learned. So, it's an indirect knowledge [based on] the experience someone else [had]. But if you're in Japan experiencing this yourself, meditating on Mount Kurama and feeling that energy, it's your direct experience that you're teaching.
DIR: Direct experience can mean going to Japan or doing the work where you live: practicing or reading books. However, I have to say, there is something exceptional about being in Japan. For me, it was understanding the power of the simplicity of the Reiki system versus complicating it. When you sit in meditation in Japan, you feel that it is perfect as conceived with your whole body, mind, and soul.
You also had a great story from one of your trips to Japan about how, as practitioners, we think the grass is always greener in other countries, especially when it comes to Reiki in healthcare.
OD: Yeah. People from my group from the US [met] a Japanese Reiki master that I presented, and they said, "Ah, it's so different here in Japan. Reiki is so well accepted, and you're doing this in every hospital. It's so different." And the [Japanese said,] "That's not really the case. We are fighting for acceptance. It's not in every hospital, as is the case in Germany. There they do this in every hospital, and it's so well accepted." I said, "Well, no, not really. There are some hospitals [offering] Reiki, but it's not common. It's not in every hospital, and it's not accepted everywhere. It's more and more popular, but we in Germany read that is the case in the US, that we'll have so many hospitals working with Reiki and it's so well accepted." So, each of us believed that [things were better] in another country.
It's a great vision for the future: that all over the world, [Reiki] is much more accepted and gets [to be a] standards therapy in hospitals. But at the moment, we had to experience that it was more a dream than a reality.
DIR: What would be your advice on communicating about the Reiki system to be more accepted in hospitals or community centers in our countries.
OD: There is a teaching in Gendai [Reiki] from Hiroshi Doi: focus on Reiki, be aware of that energy, be with it, but do the best you can and leave the rest to the universe. And I think at the same, we can, of course, have the [goal] to have it more accepted in hospitals; we can talk about this with our friends, with our relatives, we don't have to hide… but we cannot force it. It will come with time. So I think there are some lessons from the universe, [and one of them] is patience. We just need to be patient. I think in the next years and decades, [Reiki] will develop.
What we can do [meanwhile] is to come to the core of Reiki. I mean, hands-on healing is great. A treatment is fantastic, but for me, the core is the Precepts [or Principles]. If you focus on that, if you integrate this into your daily life—not to be angry, not to worry, and to be thankful—you attract things, that's [the] secret.
Normally you get something and, after [you] receive it, you are thankful. But the secret thing is, first of all, being thankful [beforehand]. And then, with the law of resonance, you attract exactly this into your life. So be aware of your frequency, be aware of your thoughts, because you're attracting exactly more of that.
If everyone dedicates more [attention] to the precepts, sharing this knowledge, and integrating them into their lives, we automatically have a different understanding and communication with each other. And finally, even how we treat our environment, our planet, the respect between others and all beings. I think that makes a difference. We are a bit like a light in the darkness if we are caring for Reiki. The people who never had any experience [with it] see us [and ask,] "Why are you behaving like this? What are the things you are convinced of?" We can just be an example and then [share with] other people what our understanding is.
DIR: I think it is so important what you mentioned about using the Reiki precepts as awareness tools for what's going on with yourself versus following them like if they were commandments. Thank you for sharing that. It's an important insight to help us integrate Reiki into our daily life. And talking about this, what is a gift Reiki has brought into your life?
OD: Reiki really is a gift. I think it's so nice to work with it. It's so nice to teach this to other people and see what a difference it makes in their lives. They tell me about their experiences with family with their health; this is such nice feedback.
DIR: You learned many modalities and are a medium. Why did you decide to stick to traditional Reiki when it comes to teaching?
OD: I think [the modalities and mediumship] are personal experiences. So, when I'm teaching, for example, Gendai Reiki, then I'm teaching just Gendai Reiki. And I tell people there are other teachers, and they have different points of view. But at that moment, I'm focusing on [Gendai's] teaching to give this style's pure content. If I'm teaching what I've learned from Frans—he works from the hara, less with chakras—then it's different teaching. Of course, I can show them that I learned from other teachers with different points of view, but I always tell them this is the pure teaching. If you are teaching this style or that style, keep each clean, don't mix them.
Of course, everybody is free to create new styles. But I think if you just keep it clean, then it can survive in this original nature. If everybody means to create something new just for having his name or his style, it's possibly more a speck of the ego and not the [pure motivation to share Reiki.
DIR: The ego part is key, right? We may have a spiritual practice, but It doesn't mean our ego is always under control.
OD: I think too that people [should not] expect anything. If they heard that some people had some sensations or visions during the attunement, they shouldn't be disappointed when they did not have them. They should come without any expectation. And then it's even much more worth it if something happens or they experienced something. And I think it's the same with Reiki. There are people who are [innately] connected to the spiritual world. [During] a treatment, [their] hand is attracted to where it is required. Others might hear like a voice saying, "Well, look for the knee as well or care for the shoulder." Every person is different, and every treatment is different. It's not that you need to be a medium or that you need to work with mediumship [to have intuition]. It's independent of Reiki. You can have it, it's an advantage, but it's not a disadvantage if you don't have it. And many things develop in time. The more you're doing Reiki, the more treatments you give, the more self-treatments you have, you're more in that energy, the more things change and develop you as a person and advance that whole thing.
DIR: I think you said two essential things. One is expectations getting in the way of experiencing the practice. And the other thing is that there is one practice, but we all will express it differently. How do you try to control your expectations from the practice or life in general?
OD: Sometimes you tell the students, "You have an intention, there's something that you would like to reach with Reiki, but you don't need to focus so much on it." In Japanese, it's the "nen," the will to do something. On one side, you have an intention to do something; on the other side, you should do this without any intention. So sometimes it's difficult to understand. So I think it's important to have a [goal], to say, "I want to reach this for my clients," but then not to focus so much on it. So just let the Reiki energy flow and work. Once the [goal] is defined, it's good. But thinking all the time about the [goal] is not that good and may distract you from just being a channel and letting Reiki flow. You are not the one to do something. You're just one to channel the energy. And in the end, it's the person who heals himself. We're just creating room for the Reiki energy to work and where all of this can happen, but we are not responsible for its success.
DIR: I love what you say because I think most of us fall into two extremes: we want to control the outcome too much, or we're unaccountable. It's a balance of aiming in the right direction and then letting go. Like archery in a way: you aim and then let that arrow go and do its work. But that is something that takes a lot of practice.
OD: I think an important of life is not to give up. So if you have had [Reiki 1 Level training], just continue; read your manual again, practice, practice, practice, and don't stop practicing. You have to go on with that to be in it. I think that's a challenge for some people. In these times, many people have a seminar here, a seminar there. Want to have more knowledge from this, from that. There are so many different aspects that you can learn, but if you [need to] focus and keep practicing. Don't stop practicing. Integrate this in your life. I think this is the key to reaching something in the end.
DIR: Yes, we need to imprint that in our minds: do not give up, keep practicing. Changing tracks, you are also a publisher of books about spirituality. A lot of people want to write their own Reiki books. Do you have any advice for them?
OD: Well, the whole publishing world changed a lot in the last ten, 15 years. I have two publishing houses at the moment. The first I started in 2002…. And then I had to launch the second editorial or publishing house because the [readership] was different. The first one was about keeping animals and pets in your house. And the other one was about spirituality. Two different kinds of readers, so I decided to have two different publishing houses. [I've heard] from colleagues that have been writing Reiki books successfully in the past. Ten years ago, they wrote a book, and if it was successful, they sold twenty to thirty thousand [books.} Then they had a second, third, and up to eight different editions.
It's quite different today. Even the most successful authors of Reiki books—many of them I know personally—are happy to reach a quantity of maybe 500 books in the first year. These are not the numbers that we were used to in the past. It's is a challenge if you are printing something, not the book on-demand [model]. Book on-demand is nice if you want to have something saying, "I have written a book." You can never get it to the wholesale markets or the shops because you have to discount. And this discount is so big that in the end, the printing costs are higher than the discount you give. So, it's absolutely impossible to work professionally with a book on demands—you can just have this as a hobby. You can have it as personal satisfaction, the fact sheet, but you can't really sell quantity and cover your costs.
If you do it the professional way, that means you need to print books. To print means quantity. So you have the printing machines running, and that's the most expensive thing. If you print 2000 copies or 3000 copies, that does not make [much difference in the] price. Just to keep the machine running, that's the main cost. If you divide the total cost by the quantity you have made, the more books printed, the more attractive the price. In my experience, I need to print at least two to three thousand books to have a price that's good enough to [sell] wholesale and to book shops. But, if you are just selling quantities of 500 [books per year], you need six years to sell them all. You need to store them in a warehouse.
Sometimes with other [kind of] books, you're more successful. You have higher quantities. But Reiki [has become] especially difficult. Just this year, I've been speaking with many bookshops and [asking them why they don't] have one Reiki book on the shelves. Why is that? They said, "Well, it's not popular. At the moment, we sell books about yoga, yoga Nidra, yin yoga, but Reiki is a thing of the past. It's not popular. It's not fashionable." So for me, Reiki is not about popularity or fashion. It's still important these days, but that's the thinking of many shop owners. They just carry one trend and then another trend. Reiki is something they sold successfully in the past, but most of them are not interested in having this on their shelves [now]. So it's quite difficult to do Reiki book projects at this moment, at least from my experience here in the German market, which includes German-speaking countries like Austria and Switzerland. Maybe it might be different than other parts of the world.
DIR: I appreciate your answer. I think it's also great to know that you can write your book, go ahead— just don't expect to become a bestseller or a millionaire!
I have one last question. I ask everyone I interview the following, "What is your biggest Reiki 'oops'?"
OD: Yes, there is one story that I would like to share. It's something I tell my students in class—it's nothing I must be ashamed of. Of course, it's a mistake, but I think a mistake is just a bad word for an experience. I think as humans, we're making experiences and not mistakes. And from that, we can learn, and others have the chance to learn.
I was a Reiki Level 2 student, and we were asked to practice distance healing. We found ourselves in a room with ten people, five were giving distance healing, and five were receiving. I had to work with a gentleman named Peter from Cologne, and he was sitting on his chair about ten meters away. So I started by being aware of being connected with Reiki, then gave this treatment to Peter, starting with his head and letting Reiki flow. Then I thought, "Oh, that's a nice lady on my side. She's attractive." I was single at that time. "Oh, she has beautiful eyes. How would it be to be with that girl? We would both be Reiki practitioners, not just one part of a couple. We could share this. We could have a nice walk. How would it feel to hold her hand." And then I went, "What are you doing? You were asked to give distant healing and not to care for the lady at your side!" I said, "Well, how much time did I lose with that? Okay. I won't do the upper part of Peter's body. I will just start with his legs." So, I gave this treatment to the legs, to the knees, and the feet. When Peter gave me feedback, he said, "I have to ask you something? I fell your presence on my head. It was so strong, but what happened then? It's like, Oliver left the room; there is nobody there anymore. Hello, Oliver, where are you? Nothing. And then you continue with next with my legs. In the meantime, what did you do? Where were you? I said, "Peter, first, congratulations, you are able to feel the Reiki energy. What happened was that I was not focused. I was thinking more about the lady at my side than giving you a treatment. I'm very sorry. Let's see this as a lesson!"
When I'm telling this [story] to my students, I say there are five different things we can learn from this. The first thing is Reiki energy exists. The second is you can feel Reiki energy. The third is you need to be focused when giving Reiki. So when you give Reiki, just give Reiki, don't think about what to cook in the evening, what to buy tomorrow. Be in the moment, be in the now. The fourth thing is to be aware that focusing matters, that it makes a difference. And the last thing to be aware is that skilled clients could read us.
DIR: I love that story. As you said, it gives you so much teaching material! Thank you for sharing that, Oliver.
OD: You're welcome.
DIR: I want to thank you for your time for your kindness. This interview is so filled with wisdom, and also I love how organized your mind is compared to mine. I appreciate how articulate and clear your answers were. Thank you so much.
OD: Well, thank you very much for inviting me!
Drawing inspired by Oliver Drewes (© nathalie jaspar)
